Half of ethnic minority Brits have reported “negative experiences” in nature because of their racial identity, according to new research shared exclusively with The Lead.
In the UK the countryside is culturally coded as white and middle-class. And some (white middle-class) people find self-worth in outdoor competence and rural identity. Clearly not-particularly-competent newcomers who are also walking while being black in those spaces sets off zero-sum thinking - your intrusion in my precious space devalues the space and my ownership of my identity.
In the event described here it’s pretty clear that whoever was responsible for the group was unprepared, unprofessional and unwilling to be a leader. But the larger problem of racial hostility is cultural and ingrained.
I have not hiked to the summit of Snowdon. I would love to do it, but my age and lack of physical fitness tells me not to and so I enjoy lower and flatter trails. This self assessment is carried out automatically by experienced hikers who will plan their hikes within the bubble of their experience and fitness.
I’ve not hired a guide to take me hiking, but this group of black people did. I would think that a good guide would assess the ability of individuals to achieve a particular task and not take the money and stride away.
A guide acting as a tail end Charlie would have prevented the incident of their hikers getting lost. As for instructing novices to take a path described as a shortcut, that is simply dangerous. Quite a few people have fallen to their deaths on this mountain after becoming lost.
My advice would be to research potential guides, make sure they are qualified and before you arrive at the foot of the trail, make sure they have a contingency plan for slow or lost walkers.
Finally, make sure your fitness is up to the task and you are wearing the correct clothing.
It sounds like they didn't so much 'hire a guide' as sign up for a guided hike - there's quite a difference. Either way, they needed to be sure they were fit enough for the walk and the guide shouldn't have suggested they take a short cut without any help. A response from the organisers was really crucial and the lack of it (or even a request for a response as far as we know) diminishes the article.
This sounds like an awful experience, especially being advised to take a short cut - downright irresponsible on the part of the leaders. Did you get a response from the organisation leading the hike?
It’s deeply ironic that non white people are treated like this in the countryside when at the same time they are criticised for not wanting to “integrate”.
To be honest, it might have been useful to hear from this tour group considering what you're alleging about them, but, i guess you've made your decision on what this was all about. Come on, there are major issues with racism in rural communities, but this is utter bullshit and you know it too. It's not racism if she can't be arsed getting fit enough to go up Snowdon. 'left us to die'. Jesus wept.
Wrong to tag this as 'rural racism' as this hiking group came on a coach, likely from an urban area. Also the group was poorly led with no back marker.
So what? Britain is the wokest sewer on the planet, a once-salubrious polity so beset by woke propaganda the place has become unlivable. Destroyed. By the left. So excuse me if I could. not. care. less. About claims of race bias. The world is so heartily sick to death of Eurotrash liberal leftist whining about oppression.
And your evidence for this is what? Your diatribe seems completely disconnected to the article. What is “woke” about 2 black women wanting to enjoy a day out on Snowden?
I’ll tell you what the world (as opposed to your bigoted bubble) is fed up of, it’s idiots like you who on the one hand complain about immigrants failing to integrate and on the other treat them like dirt when they try to do so, this story being a prime example.
Hi, Kath. Thanks for your response. Unfortunately, I use this example because over many years in Brum I've experienced this usually covert thinking. I am white European. My housemate is Birmingham born of Indian Pakistani heritage (lapsed Muslim, no headscarf markers etc) mentions fairly frequently to me the unfortunate occasions when she undergoes snubs, aggressive comments and worse when in public usually from mid-older clearly less educated white Brummies. Sad. Helpful to see from her non-white perspective what I would otherwise miss. But more positively Brummies rub along ok generally, but watch out for the risk of 'Asian' male aggression if some perceive, rightly or wrongly, that you're gay. So yes, I feel apply justified in generalising from that one incident. Oh, and the ghettoised areas of Birmingham and elsewhere!! I must assume you're white, well educated relatively sheltered middle class judging by your comment. Be well, and thanks. Michael
Yes, that's me, atho' well aware of how cushioned my life is compared to some. I have, however, worked quite a bit with Asian and black students, so not entirely without relevant experience. But your answer basically is that you weren't solely basing your comment on just the one overheard conversation, and that's fair enough.
By the way my comment was not a criticism of how the girls found their experience so negative. Any hiking group guide is responsible for all the group and acts accordingly. In this case it obviously didn't happen.
A few years back in 'white Solihull' I was working on my back under my VW Beetle. The white neighbours on the other side of the hedge were sitting out having a natter unaware of me. One, referring to the family's pleasure boat said to his companion in local Brummie, 'I really loik bein yards offshore well away in a Paki-free zone.' There you have it from the grousers mouth. Ghettoised Britain - urban, rural countryside, a few yards offshore well away from Brum...
In the UK the countryside is culturally coded as white and middle-class. And some (white middle-class) people find self-worth in outdoor competence and rural identity. Clearly not-particularly-competent newcomers who are also walking while being black in those spaces sets off zero-sum thinking - your intrusion in my precious space devalues the space and my ownership of my identity.
In the event described here it’s pretty clear that whoever was responsible for the group was unprepared, unprofessional and unwilling to be a leader. But the larger problem of racial hostility is cultural and ingrained.
The brilliant Muslim Hikers group is another resource. See Instagram, Eventbrite
I have not hiked to the summit of Snowdon. I would love to do it, but my age and lack of physical fitness tells me not to and so I enjoy lower and flatter trails. This self assessment is carried out automatically by experienced hikers who will plan their hikes within the bubble of their experience and fitness.
I’ve not hired a guide to take me hiking, but this group of black people did. I would think that a good guide would assess the ability of individuals to achieve a particular task and not take the money and stride away.
A guide acting as a tail end Charlie would have prevented the incident of their hikers getting lost. As for instructing novices to take a path described as a shortcut, that is simply dangerous. Quite a few people have fallen to their deaths on this mountain after becoming lost.
My advice would be to research potential guides, make sure they are qualified and before you arrive at the foot of the trail, make sure they have a contingency plan for slow or lost walkers.
Finally, make sure your fitness is up to the task and you are wearing the correct clothing.
It sounds like they didn't so much 'hire a guide' as sign up for a guided hike - there's quite a difference. Either way, they needed to be sure they were fit enough for the walk and the guide shouldn't have suggested they take a short cut without any help. A response from the organisers was really crucial and the lack of it (or even a request for a response as far as we know) diminishes the article.
This sounds like an awful experience, especially being advised to take a short cut - downright irresponsible on the part of the leaders. Did you get a response from the organisation leading the hike?
It’s deeply ironic that non white people are treated like this in the countryside when at the same time they are criticised for not wanting to “integrate”.
To be honest, it might have been useful to hear from this tour group considering what you're alleging about them, but, i guess you've made your decision on what this was all about. Come on, there are major issues with racism in rural communities, but this is utter bullshit and you know it too. It's not racism if she can't be arsed getting fit enough to go up Snowdon. 'left us to die'. Jesus wept.
Wrong to tag this as 'rural racism' as this hiking group came on a coach, likely from an urban area. Also the group was poorly led with no back marker.
The stories I could share.
Bad leadership. Nothing to do with colour.
So what? Britain is the wokest sewer on the planet, a once-salubrious polity so beset by woke propaganda the place has become unlivable. Destroyed. By the left. So excuse me if I could. not. care. less. About claims of race bias. The world is so heartily sick to death of Eurotrash liberal leftist whining about oppression.
And your evidence for this is what? Your diatribe seems completely disconnected to the article. What is “woke” about 2 black women wanting to enjoy a day out on Snowden?
I’ll tell you what the world (as opposed to your bigoted bubble) is fed up of, it’s idiots like you who on the one hand complain about immigrants failing to integrate and on the other treat them like dirt when they try to do so, this story being a prime example.
What a bigoted comment.
Hi, Kath. Thanks for your response. Unfortunately, I use this example because over many years in Brum I've experienced this usually covert thinking. I am white European. My housemate is Birmingham born of Indian Pakistani heritage (lapsed Muslim, no headscarf markers etc) mentions fairly frequently to me the unfortunate occasions when she undergoes snubs, aggressive comments and worse when in public usually from mid-older clearly less educated white Brummies. Sad. Helpful to see from her non-white perspective what I would otherwise miss. But more positively Brummies rub along ok generally, but watch out for the risk of 'Asian' male aggression if some perceive, rightly or wrongly, that you're gay. So yes, I feel apply justified in generalising from that one incident. Oh, and the ghettoised areas of Birmingham and elsewhere!! I must assume you're white, well educated relatively sheltered middle class judging by your comment. Be well, and thanks. Michael
Yes, that's me, atho' well aware of how cushioned my life is compared to some. I have, however, worked quite a bit with Asian and black students, so not entirely without relevant experience. But your answer basically is that you weren't solely basing your comment on just the one overheard conversation, and that's fair enough.
By the way my comment was not a criticism of how the girls found their experience so negative. Any hiking group guide is responsible for all the group and acts accordingly. In this case it obviously didn't happen.
Question. Do the Moja Collective and other like minded groups accept white members? I'm curious....
A few years back in 'white Solihull' I was working on my back under my VW Beetle. The white neighbours on the other side of the hedge were sitting out having a natter unaware of me. One, referring to the family's pleasure boat said to his companion in local Brummie, 'I really loik bein yards offshore well away in a Paki-free zone.' There you have it from the grousers mouth. Ghettoised Britain - urban, rural countryside, a few yards offshore well away from Brum...
You sound like you're generalising one comment by one neighbour...or am I misunderstanding?